How Sequin Is Changing the Game for Financial Equality - Episode 86
In today's episode, I’m excited to introduce you to Vrinda Gupta, the founder of Sequin, a financial technology company that’s changing the game for women and minorities. Vrinda shares her incredible journey from working at Visa to creating a tool that empowers us to take control of our finances, break free from credit card debt, and build real wealth. We dive into how Sequin is making banking work for us, helping us stop the bleeding from high fees and interest rates, and why it’s so important to have financial tools designed with us in mind.
About our guest:
Vrinda Gupta is the CEO & Co-Founder of Sequin, the first debit card and banking in U.S. history designed by and for women and minorities. She is a globally recognized credit expert featured by Forbes, ABC7 News, and Fintech Magazine and has been named one of the top 10 women to watch in Fintech.
Vrinda helped launch the popular Chase Sapphire Reserve credit card at Visa Inc. But, when she applied for the card she helped create, she was rejected.
This inspired Vrinda to act. She quit her job at Visa to found Sequin, to recognize women's financial power and fight against the injustices that opposed it, including credit card debt and the Pink Tax.
Money is power - and this proud first-generation Indian immigrant is on a mission to design a world where women have more of both.
You can sign up for Sequin today completely fee-free at www.sequincard.com.
https://www.sequincard.com/financiallyintentional
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TRANSCRIPT:
[00:00:00]
Naseema: What's up, my financially intentional people. I am really excited for you guys to meet Vrinda Gupta. She has an amazing story and is doing some phenomenal things around money financing credit for women and people of color. I'm not going to steal her thunder because she has an incredible It's crazy, inspiring story for you guys to hear.
So first, welcome Vrinda to the financially intentional podcast. I'm super excited to chat with you.
Vrinda Gupta: Thanks for having me. I can't wait for this. It's going to be fun. I
Naseema: Definitely. So just go start by sharing like your background. And did you start out growing up knowing you were going to be in the finance space or like, how did that evolve? How did that come about?
Vrinda Gupta: love this question because not really at all. So my story starts, I'm a first generation immigrant. My family and I immigrated from India when I was [00:01:00] young. And some of my earliest money memories are watching my very feisty immigrant mother, Feel really fearful of the financial system and, any time she would need to call the bank or make a financial decision, that was the only time that I saw this very feisty, mom kind of cower and it freaked me out, right?
It's who is this robot that's taken over my mother? On, on a serious note, I think really early on, I started associating money with power because my mother was not as confident in the financial system and she's not wrong, right? If she, made a financial mistake, that can lead to some pretty serious outcomes.
And so she deferred to my dad for financial decisions. And ultimately it was my dad making really important decisions for my family. And I wonder, some of those had my mom been involved and known, maybe it would have been a better outcome. And so when I went to finally get my first job after college, I said, I really want to [00:02:00] Understand how the system works primarily to empower myself, but also my mother and so many incredible women around me that I just felt were not as confident in the financial world.
Not because we weren't smart, but because we were just never taught at the same rates.
Naseema: But was your first job in finance.
Vrinda Gupta: It was, yeah, my first job out of college was at Visa. Yes, I worked at Visa for many years. That was
Naseema: Oh wow.
Vrinda Gupta: I wanted to work there. Yeah.
Naseema: That's cool. That's cool. So, did you get a finance degree and then went into working for Visa?
Vrinda Gupta: So I studied communications with an econ minor, I'd actually always wanted to be pre med and I got into college pre med and I, took a few pre med classes. And I just said, I, really care deeply about helping people. And I wonder if there, is a different way. And I went on this journey of trying to understand, what [00:03:00] is the single most powerful way to drive equality in this world?
And of course, medical professionals like yourself are literally saving lives, but a close second to that is financial freedom and financial empowerment, and understanding how to make the system work for you. To me, especially for women and minorities felt like the single most important thing that I could do with my life.
So I went into my work at Visa hoping that there would be, perhaps a there there. I just didn't realize how I was going to get there. So my story is interesting.
Naseema: Yeah, but I love that. I am the same with you. I went into school thinking I was going to be pre med and then realized I didn't. Necessarily like what doctors did, because the reason why I got into medicine was because I wanted to improve access to healthcare. And I was just like, Oh, doctors don't really do that.
And then subsequently changed my major to healthcare administration. And then later became a nurse where, I really can affect. Patient care directly, but I love that. She said [00:04:00] that money and financial freedom is the way to really affect equality and that's super powerful because. That is your power.
Like oftentimes people don't understand how the lack of money is typically associated with the lack of power in this country in order to actually make the changes that you want to see. It is tied to. Some monetary things and that the people that are in power because they control a lot of the money in the financial systems in this country.
And so you recognize that as an early age and kudos to you for wanting to. Impact that, and then how did that work when going into working at visa, which is 1 of the most powerful financial institutions in the world.
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head, Massima, where those with the gold make the rules, right? That's how it's worked. and one thing I found really interesting when I was working at Visa [00:05:00] was also this transfer of those with the gold, right? You're seeing, women and minorities controlling space.
So much of spending power today. And actually women control 85 percent of purchasing decisions in the U S and we're more educated than ever making more money than ever, more college degree educated than ever. And, it's such an exciting time in history, right? Where we're able to do, things that we love to do.
And, we have a presidential race coming up and just seeing who is on the ticket is so exciting, and It did feel like this big disconnect for me, though, where I was looking at, okay, where women and minorities were going in society and the new heights that we were reaching. But every time I looked around and looked at the financial system, end to end, it really was serving this white minority. And I actually learned when I was at Visa that this year, so 2024 is the 50th year anniversary of women not being required to have a [00:06:00] man sign for us to get a credit card or a bank account. And, there were situations in which that wasn't required, but it was there. to say, oh, okay, you're a woman, you're more risky.
You need a man to sign for you. And 50 years, it feels that was a while ago, but it really wasn't.
Naseema: What is that? Yeah.
Vrinda Gupta: It's wild. And so even looking, at women and minorities, financial outcomes today, I just kept on seeing end to end especially as it was around credit and around banking, women and minorities are paying higher interest rates.
We are not educated at the same rates as well. And so we're more likely to pay banking fees, especially overdraft fees. And. Obviously the gender wage gap and so many, different factors exist that affect women and minorities finances. So anyway, when I was at Visa, I felt really privileged to be in that place because I, as a young woman a woman of color, I, [00:07:00] looked around and didn't see very many people that looked like me.
And so it was. simultaneously privileged. And also there's definitely a bit of imposter syndrome there, right? Where everyone looks a certain way and you look different. So yeah,
Naseema: So what are some of the things that you did at Visa and how did that shape the company that you built now, that you're building now? Yeah. Yeah.
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah. Yeah. So when I was working at Visa, I was working on building popular credit cards and, it was a really interesting role. I wrote the rules for every single Visa credit card that was launched on the market. For the time that I was there, I also had a big hand in helping build the Chase Sapphire Reserve credit card, which is a premium credit card geared towards affluent millennials.
And it was cool to work on credit cards because, credit cards are so ubiquitous in our society and building one that was, went on to be [00:08:00] extremely popular, one of the most popular credit cards of all time was really cool. And worked for years on that product.
And when I went to apply for the credit card that I helped create, I was denied.
Naseema: That's crazy. That's crazy. Like, how do you go, how are you denied for the product that you built? And I'm sure like when people build things, they build things with themselves in mind oftentimes, which it sounds like it was like, how did that happen? Huh.
Vrinda Gupta: mean, the challenge I know now, right? And we can talk about that. But the challenge is after you are denied from credit or denied from any sort of financial tool. The regulation is that two weeks later, or within two weeks, you need to receive a reason why you were denied, but that reason is like five kind of broad things that it could be right.
It's not really that helpful. And also, by the time you are denied, it's usually a little bit [00:09:00] too late as well, right? It's like you apply, you get denied that pulls your credit. And now not only were you denied, but your credit takes a hit and it's this chicken and egg situation. But I think this is very emblematic of a lot of people who are left out of financial products, whether that is a credit card or a loan, or even paying a fee with a bank and paying an overdraft fee, it's had any of us known we wouldn't have done it.
It's not fun to pay fees. It's not fun to get rejected. And it can feel very isolating and it can also feel very much like. When was I supposed to have learned these things? And the dirty secret here is women and minorities are not being taught at the same rate about how to make the financial world work for us and how to navigate it.
There's so many studies around this where little girls and little boys are talked to about credit and finances differently. We're not taught this in schools, right? And then we graduate and [00:10:00] we're not really, banks are. Advertising to men more than they are to women. Men are subsequently having these conversations more.
And ultimately it just ends up being this, kind of situation where you're not having these conversations and you're not making the system work for you. You feel isolated. You get more and more in a hole. You feel like you're drowning and you just have nowhere to go. And it's extremely stressful, especially disproportionately for women and minorities, where again, the gender wage gap exists, right?
Or just wage gaps.
Naseema: Mm hmm. Mm hmm.
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah, managing money and credit and finances is especially stressful and, and hits women and minorities harder.
Naseema: But behind the scenes, were you seeing that the Nile rates were different, varying by, by gender?
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah, women are more likely to be rejected. And are also paying higher interest rates. One of the things that I also saw in research was women are more likely to pay back our mortgages, but we're [00:11:00] charged higher interest rates. It's just we're better to lend to and. We're still not being targeted effectively.
And all of these things led me to realize that there's a huge opportunity here, where, women and minorities, again, going so many amazing places in the society myself included, this literally happened to me. And and I just said, we deserve better.
There's never been banking designed by and for women and minorities. And It felt like the timing was right, and I looked around and I didn't see many people that looked like me doing this and just realized that this was, could be the most important thing that I do with my life is trying to make a step forward towards women and minorities and money and finances, especially around pesky credit card debt, which we'll talk about in a bit.
Naseema: It's just important to highlight the fact that We are still being treated unfairly, even though, like you said earlier, we are more [00:12:00] educated. We make better financial decisions. We are earning at levels that we have never earned before, yet we are still being highly penalized.
And it's not for the lack of education. It's not for the lack of responsibility. So what is the reason?
Vrinda Gupta: It's so complex, right? I think that if there were a simple reason, I think I would have found it right now because I've spent so many years searching. But I do think, it's a quite complicated issue, right? It's like any other big problem. There are many factors that go into it. Of course, I think ultimately, maybe if I have to say one word, it would be the patriarchy.
This is a system designed by and for men like many other systems, right? And again, the cis white male, right? A very specific man, this is designed for, and that is who is benefiting from the system. And so the way that the [00:13:00] patriarchy affects this, of course, is not having as much financial education.
It is. We don't have as much money. We are not making the system work for us, right? So we're more likely to make avoidable financial mistakes. Once you've made a avoidable financial mistake, it's a lot easier to make more avoidable financial mistakes, which turn into the cycle. And then, so much of money attitudes are generational, right?
And so then that gets passed on as well. And it's like, when and how does that cycle get broken? And that happens from not only having credible and good financial education, but also, as we all know, education is not enough, right? You need to practice. You need to have tools that are actually designed to help you.
And so that intersection, I haven't really seen. I've seen really great financial education and communities out there and that I've seen tools out there, but no one's really marrying the two together where you're learning [00:14:00] and you're also getting tools to help you really manage that plan and to end and make meaningful progress towards
Naseema: And it sounds like you created a financial tool that does that. So let's talk about that. Let's talk about the transition from Visa to you starting your own financial technology company that does address those issues.
Vrinda Gupta: absolutely. My company is called Sequin and it's actually, the name has a fun meaning to it. So sequins come from the Arabic term Sika, which means coin and during the Roman Empire, There, were these Venetian gold coins and after the fall of it, then those coins lost value. And so people would start wearing them as talismans and as decoration.
And then over time, sequins became, known as femininity and with women's clothing and just being bold. And so we loved I, I loved that background of the name. But the name aside most [00:15:00] importantly, basically, I quit my job at Visa. I got my MBA and during my MBA program was when Time's Up and Me Too was happening.
And I just said, this is the moment. It's not just that the future is female. The present is female. It's happening right now. And it was so exciting. It's so cool to see women voting with our dollars for brands that we cared about. And I was just like, this is the time. And so essentially what I started to do was interview as many women and minorities as I could.
And I talked to hundreds and hundreds of women and I kept on hearing a few things. The first one was I in credit card debt, right? I. disproportionately have experienced credit card debt. I feel like I'm drowning. I don't know what to do. I've, had credit cards throughout my life. I was never really taught how to use them the right way.
And now I'm in this bad situation. And again, these are smart, ambitious women. This is not like an intellect thing. It's a, we just, we're not taught. So the credit card debt piece was something that I mean, I just [00:16:00] saw so, so much and was just like very stressful. The second piece I saw a lot of was, okay, even my banking is I'm getting charged overdraft fees.
My money is not really growing in the checking account. I'm not really learning how to make this all work for me. And then the third thing I heard was around the rewards. So the folks who had used credit cards, they're like, okay a lot of the rewards are on travel and on dining. And I love those things, but there's also so many other things that I'm spending more on as a woman, as a minority.
Especially like. Pink tax items. So we're thinking about like health and wellness and drug stores and beauty and salons and all of these things that personal grooming things that we need to spend on. And yeah, I just looked and I was like, I think there's a way to solve these problems. Like I always started from what were the problems that we're seeing and then created solutions around it.
[00:17:00] Yeah, I can go into the solutions, but do you have any questions on the problems or anything you can
Naseema: No, no, I think you covered that. Great. But yeah, let's talk about the solutions because like you said before, like we know there's an issue. There's things that work on the financial literacy piece. There's things that, there's tools out there, but nothing that really combines the two. So super interested in seeing how you do that.
Vrinda Gupta: We're constantly improving talking to our user base as well of amazing women and minorities. But essentially, when you sign up for Sequin, it works the best for women who have credit card debt. And so if you have credit card debt, the first thing we say is we want to help you out.
Break that cycle and stop the bleeding. I know many nurses are listening to this, right? Stop the bleeding immediately, right? That's the first step. And so we say, okay, you might, be trying to avoid the credit cards by spending on a debit card, but your traditional debit card is not really earning you rewards.
The checking account isn't growing. So [00:18:00] we are going to set you up with a Sequin checking account and debit card. Okay. And the checking account earns you high interest. So the money in your account is growing. You don't need to have it in an investment because again, if you have credit card debt, you're not going to make back the returns in the stock market.
So we say, okay, have your money here. It'll grow. And we don't charge any of those fees. We don't have overdraft. You cannot even overdraft on Sequin. We saw women and minorities like paying more because of that. We're like, we don't even have that capability. So there's no hidden fees. And then we'll set you up also with a debit card that is earning you rewards.
And I'll talk about the rewards,
Naseema: If there's no overdraft fees, we'll like, if someone doesn't have the money in their account, will it just deny the transaction? Yeah,
Vrinda Gupta: it'll just deny. And actually, one of the features that our community members love so much about sequin is anytime you make a transaction on sequin or anytime there's money that comes [00:19:00] in and out of your account, we proactively send you a text message telling you what happened and also what remaining balance you have.
So you always know what's going on with your account proactively versus again, like problem solution heard so many women being like, I checked my bank account multiple times a day. I'm like, you don't need to do that. We'll just tell you what is in there and you can go and live your life. So it's small, like delightful moments like that.
But yeah, we'll, we'll set you up with a check, a high interest checking account with no fees. We'll get you a debit card as well. Our Sequin Rewards Visa Debit Card, I will pull it up in a second, but they're coral and you can put a money mantra on them, which I love.
Naseema: 1 that said feminine financial revolution. I love
Vrinda Gupta: love that one. Yeah, it's so fun. We see so many song lyrics, so many affirmations. Someone said, are you sure on their card just to be like mindfully spending? I just love that. Love them coming in. And yes, [00:20:00] and that debit card is going to earn you cash back. So typically debit cards don't earn you cash back.
Sequel does, and you can earn up to 6 percent cash back where women are spending more. So that's on pharmacies, on drug stores, on gyms, on beauty stores, on salons. There are a ton of categories. And we just ask that you spend 500 anywhere on the debit card in a month, and then you'll unlock the 6%, but even if you don't hit that threshold you'll still earn some cash back.
So the first thing is stopping the bleeding. Stop using the credit card. Stop using the bank account that is doing nothing for you. Stop using the debit card. That's charging you overdraft fees and is not earning you rewards. Like stop, stop and stop. So that's first. And then the second piece that we do is we're going to build you a custom plan to pay off your credit card debt that actually works.
So we say, plug your existing credit cards in. We are going to. [00:21:00] Aggregate all of the information that you need from your different credit cards. So we'll tell you your balance, your due dates, how much interest you would pay based off of what you're paying right now. We can help you simulate what your time is to debt free and how much interest you're actually paying.
And then we can help you make a budget to say, okay, you can pay. A little bit more. We also help you budget for self care as well. You can see your time to debt free go down. The interest that you're paying actually go down and you can set alerts to manage all of this. So you can get notified when your credit utilization is too high.
You can get notified when your balance is cut, when your payment is coming up, you get notified when it goes through. We just are really into keeping you posted because we heard that so much. It's I just feel like there's a million things going on, especially as a woman. I'm just juggling like so many things.
We're like, we need to keep you posted. So step two is actually getting you a plan. That's going to work. And help you stick with it. And then the third piece is an accountability community and support because [00:22:00] we as women are communal creatures and that is our superpower and obviously giving the tools and the education is so great, but just having that support too, is so important too.
So we have a great Slack community where every week we'll share wins and we'll tell us. One thing you did for self care and then also tell us about a money win or a credit win as well. We'll also share horror stories. We'll share the bad, the worst advice you ever got about debt payoffs. So anyway, all of this is totally free.
We make money every time you swipe the card, the merchant pays us. It's the same way that every single debit card credit card makes money, but it's a no fee to you. And we have a membership option. If you are interested in getting more, you can get even higher interest on checking ATM reimbursement. We have that membership option.
And of course, we'd love for you all to be members as well. But yeah, [00:23:00] that's the solution. It's very long winded. Cause there were a lot of problems that we were looking to
Naseema: No, but I think that's great number one. Thank you for sharing your like your fee structure and what goes into that because a lot of people I don't think understand how Kind of that these financial technology companies work and how they get paid. But also that you had a tiered service that you can pay into that offers more incentives.
So I love that you share that the transparency is golden because that is something that is lacking in the finance space in general. And a lot of people do not understand what they're paying for. Thank you. Number two, like there was just like, So many things that this platform is addressing that traditional banks just do not touch on period.
And I don't, I don't understand why anybody goes to these traditional banks. When I say traditional banks, I'm talking about the Wells Fargo, the Bank of America's that continuously are in headlines [00:24:00] in the headlines for not only just not providing great. Like banking services, but also for like practices that are totally unethical and I've totally put it set back a lot of minorities and women For financially for decades, and so I don't understand why people bank there, but there's so many great incentives that you have, especially.
I love getting cash back for self care. That is clutch right there. Because yes, like you said, we have so much financial buying power. We are the ones that do all of the spending and, yes, our spending should be catered towards the self care things and the bonuses and the cash back should be around that.
And again, that's a pain point that a lot of financial institutions don't touch on. They give you cash back for groceries and cash back for for gas. I want cash back for a pedicure. Okay, because I spend a lot of money on my
Vrinda Gupta: Yes!
That from Sequin!
Naseema: Yes, I [00:25:00] love that. And I like the community aspect, because again, like you said, we are communal, but we need to hear those stories.
We need to not only hear the wins, but we need to hear the failures. We need to know that there are people like us. And the thing that is going to drive change more than anything is seeing that it is possible for you. And it's, In a system that has been prevalent by cis white males, it's oftentimes we don't feel like Walt is for us, but for you to build a community that shows like, no, it is for us and we are here and we are supporting you and we also are a place where you can come and talk to and ask your questions in a non judgmental kind of way gives.
Women and our marginalized communities so much more power. So I love what you're doing behind the scenes. I love the systems. I love you stopping the bleeding from credit card debt. But a lot of that is just because of [00:26:00] education. Like a lot of people get into credit card debt and continue to pay those fees as a cycle, just because they didn't know better or want.
weren't taught better. And when you were like talking about we aren't taught like the same kind of financial lessons as, our male counterparts, I was thinking about like old school example of the Cosby show, you remember all the Cosby show back in the day bill Cosby sitting down with his son, Theo, and like giving him a set amount of money and being like, this is what you need to do to run a household.
And he did this great financial lesson, but then I'm thinking like, Theo was the only boy. He didn't do that with Vanessa. He didn't do that with his oldest daughter. You know what I'm saying? Like nobody else in that household got that lesson. And I know that's a fictional a TV show, but those Things, those fictional things are often what we use as an example of how we raise our kids and if you continuously see a [00:27:00] man being educated versus a woman being educated, your propensity to educate the male in your life, even if you didn't come from means like is higher than educating those women.
And I'm just like, Pulling out those messages that we see in society over and over again. And if we don't have a counter message of a woman being taught, then. When does that, that change happen? And so I love what you're doing because you're countering those messages you're giving you're giving power back to the women, but there's also backlash against that.
And I want to talk about that because we have seen and I get it all the time. We have seen attacks that say this is discriminatory because it's excluding men. So what about reverse discrimination or reverse racism and all of those kinds of things? I'm And I know for your, for your business, you have to raise money and all of these kinds of things.
And you have to be around these traditional institutions oftentimes to even just begin. What [00:28:00] kind of backlash have you received for targeting just women and, and communities of color?
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah, absolutely. One thing that is great about Seguin is it's all genders welcome. So if someone wants to come in and be on Seguin, we really welcome them. We just want to make sure the vibe is right? That you believe in, certain tenants, especially Equality and equity for women, right?
I think especially as it comes to, okay, why do women need this? What's different? I think it's a really great educational moment, but the thing I also say, and I think the president of the Women's World Bank said this, she said, when we build products and services designed for women and minorities, they work better for everyone.
Naseema: A hundred
Vrinda Gupta: And the opposite is not true. And, We've seen that time and time again, right? One of my favorite books is Invisible Women, and [00:29:00] the entire book is an expose of how a world designed by and for men leads to worse outcomes for women. And I know you must have many healthcare professionals following you. So some of the stats that maybe you all have heard as well are a lot of drugs are tested on men and not just on women.
So women will have more side effects or even car the seatbelts and like the safety features on cars are built around. a man's body versus a woman's body. And then women were dying more often fatally in car accidents. And then the worst part of this is when they found that that was the case, he said, okay we don't want to change the dummies that we build.
So let's just make them shorter. And that obviously didn't help the problem because women are built differently, right? Our proportions are different. Everything's different. I'm not sure where that landed and it does freak me out. Like every time I drive actually to have that thought in my [00:30:00] mind. But the same is true of the financial system.
And we're still We see the outcomes. We see women paying more in fees. We see women making mistakes. We see women not having equal access to really important financial tools, right? Access to credit is access to opportunity being set up. Financially can lead to so many amazing things, but also the opposite is, is disproportionately detrimental to women where.
How do you leave a bad relationship? How do you leave a bad job? How do you give yourself the optionality to live? All of that is finances. So I think to answer your question to Seema, it's a really good one is I think anyone who asked that question, I always take that as an educational moment where.
These aren't just feelings, right? There are, there's stats, there's bodies of research. This is well documented. It's just a matter of being taught. And [00:31:00] coincidentally, that is so much of what we're doing even at Sequin with, changing some of the problems with the financial system
Naseema: I love that. Facts over feelings, you guys. Okay, so we are addressing facts.
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah.
Naseema: We are addressing facts here. Okay. , and I love it. So I just want you to share like somebody wants to join sequin.
Vrinda Gupta: Yeah, banking with Sequin. Experiencing our tools, our community, our education. Yeah.
Naseema: Yeah, how do they do that? Mm hmm.
Vrinda Gupta: We have a special link for your listeners, Naseema. So if you had to sequincard. com slash financially intentional then you yeah, we'll be able to access our products, check everything out again.
It's totally free and we're starting a. Financial feminine revolution here. So we would love to have all of your listeners, Naseema get on sequin and share it far and wide with loved ones especially the women in our
Naseema: Yes, and [00:32:00] I love it. And especially if you are struggling with credit cards, I feel like this is an excellent solution and they have built in tools to help you pay down that debt, which I know a lot of my listeners are dealing with, especially now when people are just struggling day to day to get by and relying heavily on credit cards.
I feel like this is a great tool to help you reverse that. Stop the bleeding, like you said. And, start actually getting real help, start paying down that debt. So I love it. I love everything that you're doing at sequence. I think it's a phenomenal company. I don't understand why people use traditional banks.
Like I literally just posted yesterday, like y'all still messing with Wells Fargo, like who is doing that and why, but if you are, and you feel like you could be doing so much more with your money and you can be banking with a bank institution that is actually aligned with your goals and on the side of making sure that you are building financially, I feel like Sequence is a great tool, [00:33:00] so I will have that link in my show notes and Brenda, thank you so much for sharing your story.
And I think what you're doing is phenomenal. And I love companies like Sequence who are changing the game and actually Leveling the playing field and empowering women and people of color to win financially. So I'm so grateful for you. So
Vrinda Gupta: you for having me and thank you for having your platform to be talking about these topics. It's so important. So this is so much fun. Thanks so much.
Naseema: much fun. All right. A chat later.
Hey there I’m Naseema
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