This Nurse Practitioner is promoting Self-care in Healthcare - Episode 29 (Classic Episode)

In this episode of the "Nurses on Fire" podcast, host Naseema interviews fellow podcaster Vanessa Casper from the "Doses of Poor" podcast. Naseema and Vanessa dive into Vanessa's nursing journey, discussing how she started as a nursing assistant at a young age and eventually became a nurse practitioner. Vanessa shares her experiences working in different healthcare settings, her passion for teaching, and her transition into preventive care as an adult gerontology nurse practitioner. They also touch on the financial aspects of pursuing higher education in nursing and the sacrifices Vanessa made to invest in her career. The conversation explores the importance of advanced care planning and the role of healthcare professionals in improving patients' quality of life. Vanessa reflects on her experiences during the COVID-19 pandemic, including being furloughed and the challenges faced by primary care providers. Overall, the episode highlights Vanessa's dedication to making a positive impact in healthcare and her commitment to keeping patients comfortable and prepared for their medical journeys.

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TRANSCRIPT:

[00:00:00] Naseema: All right, nurses on Fire. I am super honored to be joined by a fellow podcaster, Vanessa Casper, of the Doses of Poor podcast. What is up Vanessa? How are you?

[00:00:14] Vanessa: Hema? I'm so excited to be here. Thank you for having

[00:00:16] Naseema: me. Of course. Of course. And we'll just hop right in and I wanna talk about your nursing journey.

How did you. Start off in the world of nursing. I know you started pretty young, so just excited to hear your story.

[00:00:31] Vanessa: Okay. First of all, I'm still young. I am like, hold on, let's back the train up. But yes, I did start when I was 19 years old, I was a nursing assistant, like literally graduated from high school and the next week I was in a class for learning to be a C n A and.

I, as a young person, I really felt like. In this space where you have to choose what you wanna do with your life. And I don't feel like high school, and I, I, if you have any international listeners, I don't feel like that primary schooling kind of teaches you to prepare for life and what you're gonna have to do.

And I thought, I'm gonna look into nursing. I always felt the pull to nursing, even like I had a little fisher price. Plastic stethoscope and a little syringe when I was a little kid. Like I remember playing with that stuff, but I think my mom was kind of pushing me in a certain direction, but yeah, I, I was a nursing assistant for five years and completed my two year nursing degree.

And. I worked my way through school to do that and had very little debt at that time. And I went to a community college and got married very young, so that's kind of how it began.

[00:01:53] Naseema: Yeah. I love that. So you started Yes. You, you are still very young. I'm still very young too, I'd like to say, even though next month I'm turning 40, but you know, still feel very young.

Your

[00:02:05] Vanessa: skin is beautiful. Oh

[00:02:07] Naseema: my God. Oh, thank you. Not really. All this mask knee is not very nice to me, but, I'll take it, girl. I'll take it. But yeah, I love how you, you, you got into nursing very early, but still not really knowing what you wanted to do and then worked as a C N A and then went and got your two year nursing degree, but.

Now you're so much more, so you're a nurse practitioner now. Mm-hmm. And I, I know you went to school very cost effectively early on. Talk about that transition into becoming a nurse practitioner.

[00:02:45] Vanessa: Yeah, so I, yeah, I think I became a nurse at 22 or 23 then with my two year rn and people knock like the L p N route or the, the a d N route, people knock it.

But you guys, like I. I, I think I had maybe two grand in college debt at that time, and I was able to work as a nurse, and so then I did a B S N completion program because, that's what hospitals want. But I was able to work through that and because I was working for, I. I guess organizations that would comp me for getting that B S N I got part of it paid for too.

So again, I graduated with A B S N with not a whole lot of debt. Let's say like less than what, like probably less than 20. Wow. But

[00:03:35] Naseema: you know what I, and I just wanted to interrupt you because I think that, That is actually the optimal way to be a nurse. I tell people all the time with all my degrees, like that look really good on paper.

I still make the same amount of money as an associate's prepared nurse, so let's not get it twisted. Okay. Yeah. If I would've been smart, like really pla, practical, smart, not paper degree smart, I would have gone the ADN route and then had the hospital, like you said, Pay for me to get my bachelor's degree or any advanced degrees, and that would be the more cost effective way to do it.

So yeah, I applaud you on that. And af that's actually the route that I suggest a lot of people

[00:04:16] Vanessa: take. Yeah. And for me, I had I got married and divorced in that time and divorce really puts a like. A wrench into your finances. It, it looks bad on your credit. There's all sorts of things that happen.

So I, I did have to take out some loans for, for my B S N, but not a lot. But it was probably because I had that I. Other factor of going through a divorce at a very young age and needing financial help at the time and not having, your whole, the, the ability to qualify for a loan or a grant.

Like all of that changes when you go from a two person household to a one person household and all of that. So. That was really hard for me emotionally. I was very young. My coping skills weren't as good. And I, I had this huge hit to my, to my emotional, physical, mental, financial health, and I still needed to make it through school.

So it was, it was an interesting time, but, Then I worked. I worked and worked and worked. I was at the bedside for years and years. I was probably, I think I went back to school after being a bedside nurse after seven years. And at that point I had gotten my C C R N, I had gotten trauma certified. I had gotten my B S N and I had worked full-time on nights and days, and I did.

Academia too. I love teaching. I love seeing light bulbs go off in students, like they, their eyes light up and they get it. I just, there's so much that I got to experience as a regular nurse. But one of the reasons I went back to school is because, I was in the I C U and I would see these preventable problems get so bad and end up needing admission to the hospital and an I C U stay and a huge Like lots of suffering that could have been prevented.

And so I really wanted to get in front of that and prevent that. And so I have a primary care adult jro NP certification. And so one of my goals is to talk to folks about their advanced care planning. What do they really want? Do they want to even be hospitalized or they want, do they want management through home care?

And so, What I do now is prevent a lot of that and what I, I, I think that it's really, it feeds my soul to be able to do that. But let me tell you the six figure debt that I took on to go back for my D N P.

[00:06:58] Naseema: Listen, it's not a game. It's not a game. It's a little harder to fund that. D M P I know. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Hence why I'm not a D M P. I'm, I'm a just plain old mp, but that came with a $200,000 student loan debt, so, oh my gosh.

[00:07:16] Vanessa: Yeah, so I did, they, they have a lot of these programs now that are B S N to D N P where you can bypass the Masters.

So it was a four, it was a four year program for me. And it was an amazing experience and I would do it. All again, I would absolutely do it again. It was wonderful for me. It was wonderful for my growth as a person and as a professional. But yeah, it really added up. And once you get to grad school, I'm sure some of your listeners might know this, that.

There aren't any financial options for you. There aren't grants and scholarships available to graduate students like there are for undergraduate, and unless you work, like I was not able to work full-time through my program and so my. System couldn't fund my education moving forward. And so it, like some people are able to work if they go very part-time in their program or if they can do part-time in both.

But I was full-time for about four years, so I, I really, I in school and so I really couldn't work full-time and get that education benefit from my employer. And so I really had to take out. The loans for it, and I'm paying for it now. I, I considered it an investment though. I thought, okay, I'm taking six figures for loans, but I'm gonna make six figures a year and I should be able to do this.

I, I, I considered it an investment but it, it weighs on me heavily. It does.

[00:08:54] Naseema: Yeah, it's, it's a it's definitely an investment, but I really like how you saw a problem and you saw it firsthand in the I C U, and then you went to the other side. And was like, how can I prevent this? And your DM P allows you to do that.

And I feel like not only is it like a huge savings to the healthcare system to be more preventative and proactive, but it's just an a huge improvement to people's quality of life, not to get to the point where they're in the I C U and having to sustain all this medical treatment for things that are totally preventable.

Mm-hmm. And for you to move into that side, I think is Super important is, and it's the thing that we need. I think that's the way the healthcare needs to shift, even though they say it's supposed to have been like that. I think that we're medicalizing everything and it's mm-hmm. Kind of to our detriment.

But yeah, I mean, like you made a huge sacrifice in order to be there, but I like the way that you phrase it. You're making an investment in yourself and the investments in yourself, I like to say are the greatest investments we can make. And so I applaud you for doing that. Because what you do is definitely essential to improving healthcare for everybody.

So I appreciate that.

[00:10:15] Vanessa: I, I really feel that way. I do. And especially that's been heightened during covid, if one of my patients became covid positive, I had already had advanced care planning discussions with them and their families. Everybody knew what the plan was. If we were gonna go to the hospital, we knew if we were gonna try to treat at home with oxygen at home and things we can do at home.

We already had a plan in place because I, as an adult jro, especially the gerontology aspect, like we are preparing for what does the end of someone's life look like? And like it's coming for all of us, death and taxes. The only things that are guaranteed in life. Yes. And so I really try to prepare my, my patients because like it doesn't have to look like.

You are going down in a blaze of glory in the I C U, it can look like you're at home with your family and you're comfortable and people are coming in and helping you. And so that's what happened during Covid where I, I feel like covid strains have been really bad in certain areas of the country, and.

For some of my patients, it didn't matter what we did, even if we did hospitalize them, there were patients that, they get hospitalized and they still die because the strain was so bad. And so I felt like what I was doing by helping folks to be prepared for what's coming to the best of my ability.

I mean, none of us know what the hell we're doing with Covid, but. But I feel like if people came back positive and came, came to see me, I feel like I could prepare them for what was coming. And I feel like that's really essential work when hospitals are filling up and there isn't room at the hospital, but I have sick people that aren't going to survive.

It's, they're hard decisions. But I feel like I was able to keep people comfortable no matter what their outcome was. And I think that is is essential work. Yeah.

[00:12:23] Naseema: How did you fare during this whole pandemic? Now I know we're still in, we're we're, we're not through it yet, but like how did you fare, like from the beginning to the end?

Like in, in having to deal with this, and this is something that we've never experienced as healthcare providers. I wanna know how you got through it.

[00:12:44] Vanessa: You would think that primary care is considered essential, right? You would think that folks need to come in and get tested. They need, their chronic conditions like C O P D and stuff that I manage all the time would be exacerbated by a covid infection.

But I was furloughed. I was furloughed for several weeks where we did one week a month of furlough and we just, and they called it, they called it voluntary furlough, but like it was unpaid. They did allow me to take p t O for some of it, which luckily I had, but not everybody has that. So, yeah, it was kind of like in the beginning I think organizations were struggling with financial decisions and my organization didn't lay anybody off, so we were very lucky, but I know a lot of people got furloughed.

And it wasn't just my organization. People were getting furloughed and laid off everywhere. So I did take some furlough time and I was happy to do it. Honestly, like it was hard. I mean, as outbreaks started happening in the beginning and none of us knew what to do, this was before Remes. Avir and Decadron were really known to be, I mean, what last summer we kind of.

Found that those were helpful, but in the beginning, like there was nothing, in the beginning it, there was so much hearsay. We weren't sure. There was still a lot of disbelief out there about covid being a hoax. I just, it's been quite a rollercoaster, but in primary care We're part of the frontline.

A patient walks into the clinic with a cough. What do you do? And, and there wasn't p p e often, I think primary care has, has been overlooked by employers as frontline. Like I, I'm a pepper. I need to wear a pepper because I have a super crooked nose. That's my life. I was born that way. And I never passed my fit test.

I, I never, I don't think I've ever passed it, ever. And so I need a pepper and pepper was not supplied to me during this whole pandemic because the hospital was prioritized. And there wasn't, there wasn't P p e. I'm still reusing P P E. And I ended up investing in a pair of toggles and buying my own face shields.

And so I'm, I'm purchasing some of that just to protect myself, but luckily my practice did change a lot where I was able to work virtually a lot. And so where I think my employer recognized. That the p p e wasn't there and the, there were, there were bigger issues that like, just couldn't be solved.

It's not necessarily anyone's fault, it was just like the, the hand we were all dealt. But they did make accommodations so that I could work virtually and see some of my patients virtually. So that made me feel protected and then I got vaccinated and I'm, I'm back in person. So, yeah, it's been a wild ride.

[00:15:57] Naseema: It's been a wild ride. Definitely. And I just feel like just the emotional toll has to be substantial because of all the changes that have happened. I mean, not only in the management that you do, but just personally in your life, the transitions, the accommodations that you've had to make to just. Keep yourself safe that you, so that you can just work.

I mean, it's tremendous. And so I know you have this podcast Dose of Support podcast, which focuses on self-care and of course I feel like self-care is essential, especially for people who work in healthcare. Can you talk about how you started this podcast, where the idea came about?

[00:16:40] Vanessa: Yeah, so I was on furlough.

And it was an idea I had in the shower.

[00:16:46] Naseema: That's all good ideas come

[00:16:47] Vanessa: in the shower. Yeah. Right. And y'all, I have a little baby. He's, he's under two. He is about to turn two and I have not slept for two years. Like he has not slept through the night once, not. Once, so I'm pretty sure I was showering at 2:00 AM because that's when I had time.

And this idea came to me because I was on furlough and I was just like so many, I was feeling scared. I was on the frontline and scared. And there was so much un, so much unknown about Covid. And to be honest, after all my time in the I C U, like we've needed self-care and healthcare. We've needed employers to step up and take care of their employees.

We've needed better structures, better working environments, better ways of coping when we see hard things. I mean, I remember coding like a. Like a 20 year old girl, I literally doing chest compressions like te just a terrible moment, right? I remember coding this person and then, 20 minutes later going and taking care of my other patient, like there is nothing in place for debriefing.

There is nothing for healthcare workers. And in addition to that, I, my husband is a respiratory therapist, so I have a little bit of insight to what his profession goes, goes through, and he, he would describe terrible code scenarios. Respiratory therapy comes to every code. And then I thought, okay, chaplains go to every code and, and in this terrible healthcare climate during Covid, I was thinking like, Physical therapy can't happen the way it used to and so all of these healthcare professionals are doing this work that's unseen, unrecognized, and so Dose of Support is an interdisciplinary healthcare podcast.

We actually have a wide variety of professionals on the show. And I know that your podcast is really. Driven for nurses. But I just wanted to say if nurses had cured burnout by now. We like, we clearly don't have our shit together. Maybe we should learn from other professionals on how they're doing.

And so every week I have a new professional on the show a chaplain, pt. I've had a s like I have had a sterile technician come on the show. The people that sterilized for the or. I've had CNAs come on, I. I really hear from different folks. They share stories, things that they've been through, and then they share what they do for self-care and healthcare.

And every week we just talk about new ideas and we talk about representation and we learn about each other. And I think how can we solve? The self-care problem, our employers are not gonna do it. Our employers are not gonna take care of us. We need to find ways to take care of us. And that's how Dose of Support was born.

And we're about, we're over 40 episodes in, I don't know when this episode will air but as of this recording, we have 41 episodes and most of them are Me interviewing someone. And I, there's a couple solo episodes as well, and I, we have a very strong Instagram community. We have a Facebook community.

I have a website and I. I just really, the podcast has given me a dose of support. It has given me the ability to be creative during a really hard time. Right. And I've made amazing connections and so the podcast doesn't make me any money, but there are things that hit, it's given me that are priceless, like the connections and networking that I've done.

Like I connected with a speech therapist and my little kiddo isn't talking very well, and she gave me all sorts of ideas and now he's talking so much better. And it's literally like this dose of support is a community that helps each other, and that is what healthcare workers need. Yeah.

[00:21:03] Naseema: Yeah, I, this is really great.

I, I love what you said about not waiting for somebody else to help us through this self care issue. Like we have to take this on ourselves, but I love the interdisciplinary approach because Yeah, obviously nurses have not. Figured it out. And this is not my first self-care episode, but I feel like it's something that is overlooked and I feel like it's something that, we know we need, but.

Either don't know how or don't take the time to really invest in for ourselves, and it's to our detriment. So I love that. On your journey to Just your own self-care and going through all the things that you go through. I mean, let's talk about the fact that you have a child that has not slept through the night like that is like living in a torture chamber, like not sleeping.

Yeah. I mean like that's on top of being a nurse, going through covid, being furloughed, like all these issues. I mean, I mean, like you have gone through so much yet and still you still created this community not just for yourself, but for other people to be able to figure out what they need to do to be able to take care of themselves, to get through this time.

And I think that it is. Super imperative, super important, and I just love that you're doing that. Yeah.

[00:22:39] Vanessa: Most episodes are under 30 minutes too. I know how busy healthcare workers are. Like I know, like I get it. I'm there, I'm doing it. I'm a healthcare worker just like you. And one thing that I talk about, Is self-care is really a privilege for a lot of people.

And so sometimes we get political on the podcast because you cannot have self-care if you're feeling oppressed. If you're feeling like specifically lately with all of the Asian related hate that is going on in communities like I. I feel like unless healthcare workers address that there's no equality in healthcare, there's still racism in healthcare.

There's still white supremacy and patriarchy. So we talk about all the hard stuff too. Like it's not all rainbows and butterflies and you can just go do some yoga and you're gonna feel better. Like it's, it's also hard stuff that we have to tackle. It's not always easy conversation. But like this week episode 41, I did drop a solo episode because I really, I had a shitty week last week.

It was just awful. And sometimes there isn't self-care. Sometimes you have to process your emotions. You have to sit with it and. Sometimes you can't do it alone and you need therapy. And so we talk about it's, it really isn't just superficial stuff. And I think that that is also, when you are in it at the bedside, coding somebody or dealing with a tough family, we become hardened and we don't process what we're seeing, what we're doing, and.

At dose of support. Sometimes that's what we do. We process that and then we talk about how we can move forward. So self-care and healthcare self-care is the saying, but it's, it's so much more, right? Like h and like you and I talked about. Self-care. Financial care is self-care. Being financially, I mean it like there is so much to self-care, but I just wanna acknowledge that not everyone can take that time to take care of themselves because they're going through something that I don't understand or whatever.

And like last week there was nothing. There was nothing I was gonna do that was gonna make me feel better. And you just have to sit with that sometimes and process that. And so I just wanted to put that in there too because it is hard to. Just tell someone, oh, take a journal and journal how you're feeling when you have eight kids and a full-time job and so I wanted to also just be real that it's not easy to operationalize self-care and, and self-care. Changes in the moment for what you're needing. Like I've been, I told you at the beginning, before we started recording, I'm planning a funeral. I'm like, there's literally a funeral this week that I have to plan and that's not fun.

And that's and I'm gonna need different self-care. I'm gonna need different things this week than I would need on a normal week. You know what I mean?

[00:25:45] Naseema: Yeah, I, what really stood out to me is when you said self-care is a privilege. It definitely is, but I also love the fact that you talk about those hard things.

You talk about the times when you know It's just not practical and it's hard and like what do you do when you have all these things on your plate and you're planning a funeral? Or what do you do when you're in this system, this healthcare system, which is not set up for, People of color and minorities and, the hard, the hard challenging things.

I love that you address all of those things. And it, to me, like when, when you were describing the podcast, it's like this is like a resource that you didn't even know you needed. Yeah. Something that you, that, that you've always needed but you didn't even know you needed because there's nothing else like this out there.

So I think it's incredible what you're doing. Like I said, like this is not the first time that I've talked about self-care on here, but this is definitely the first time where I looked at it, I looked at it like the way you described it is like Jess, like sometimes there just can't be any self care.

Yeah. And we can't even get to self care without talking about. The really hard issues, inequities. Mm-hmm. The, the, just all the things that happen in life. So I think that your podcast house is definitely a great resource for just anybody in the healthcare industry that needs a little bit of support or release or community or just I feel like, it's super isolating to feel.

Just, I don't know. It's just isolating because we're supposed to be these healthcare providers and people look at us like, we've got it all figured out, but we don't. And we struggle and we go through things and we have just all the issues in the background as well that people are dealing with, but, At the same time, we don't necessarily have time to process it.

And so I think that this is a, like I said, a great resource that you didn't even know that you needed.

[00:27:54] Vanessa: Don't you think like in nursing too, there is this undercurrent of you cannot be seen as struggling. You cannot be seen as it, it almost is synonymous with. Incompetence. If you're showing weakness or emotion or struggling, then you can't take a harder patient caseload or you like, don't you think you f i I feel like there's this like uns unsaid thing in nursing where you are not.

Good enough if you show that emotion at least I, I definitely experienced that at the bedside in particular.

[00:28:38] Naseema: Yeah. It's, it's seen as unprofessional and, that's challenging. But you know what, I'm one of those kind of people that I don't. I don't care. Like I'm all in you're gonna get all of this.

Yeah. Yeah. You're gonna get all of me, because that's the only way I know how to show up. And I'm in labor and delivery. And I think like one of the most powerful things you can do is to be in the emotions with your patients, and especially during hard events like demises, like mm-hmm. Like you have to be able to empathize even though you have all these work, all this work to do, you have to, submit all this paperwork, call the donor network, do all these kind of things like you are dealing with.

A major loss. And I know you've seen it in an ICU way more than I see it, and so I don't, I don't deal with death very well, but I think it's super important to be able to be there. Like I cry with my patients because like I need them to understand like it's okay yeah. To release those emotions, but yeah.

But overall, like it's seen as super unprofessional and we have to appear like we have these hard shells, which is like, Tear, it tears you up on the inside. It's not right. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's just not right.

[00:29:52] Vanessa: And then you go home and you're supposed to go to bed or then you like, so what do you do when you like, let me ask you, I'm gonna ask you, Naima, what do you do for self-care when you see when you have a hard day?

Do you work a day shift or a night shift or,

[00:30:07] Naseema: you know what, it is crazy. I don't have time for self-care. It's like I work nights, I work the weekends because, coronavirus and homeschooling and kids schedules and being a single mom like I have to be here to pick up and drop off my kids, or, help them with school, yeah, pick him up and drop off. My daycare help with my older daughter, with school, so I come home and I don't have time for myself, like I don't have. Mm-hmm. There's no days off. The time that my kids aren't here is a time where I'm working or somebody else is watching them. So it's either work or home, work or being with my kids and taking care of them and making sure that they're okay.

But there's very little time for me, and if I was able to practice healthcare, it would just be like a bath. Yeah. With some epon salt, yeah. And that's about it. Like I, we don't have time to process these things, and so yes. They build up and yes. It's, it's not great. It's mm-hmm.

Creates that burnout that you

[00:31:08] Vanessa: were talking about. Mm-hmm. Yeah, and so that's part of what we talk about on dose of support is how are you practically implementing something? And it's different every week. Some people journal, some people exercise, some people take a hot bath. Some people have these extreme routines that I, I am floored by.

Some people get up at. Three 30 in the morning and do an hour of their own thing before their kids get up. And you know what? I like sleep too much and I am so sleep deprived that I don't understand how people do that. But that's what's so cool is like everyone has their own thing that they would like to do or that they're trying to do.

And we've had people come on that say, I tried this and it did not work. I had I think it's episode 15, I had an Australian occupational therapist come on, and he had to try like a bunch of different things and some things just did not work. And so the discussion around how you make it work. Is part of what we do because it doesn't work.

Like I joke all the time on the show, I don't have a daily gratitude practice. I don't know how the fuck people do that. Like some people sit there and they sit with their coffee and they say, I'm grateful for clean air and this delicious coffee. And they're able to operationalize that and do it every day.

And I. Can barely function without my coffee. So I'm like, how do you. How are you even like that mindful that early in the morning, I'm not a morning person, hence why we're recording in the afternoon in my time. But so that's why I'm like, everyone is so different and there's something for everybody in each episode and I I hopefully your listeners are like, wow, she is entertaining.

Cuz I do try to make it entertaining too. Like when you're listening, I'm, I'm this sarcastic bitch. On my show too.

[00:33:05] Naseema: I love it. No, but what's the best part about it is you're just like me. Like you just keep it real. Yeah, just keep it real. And I think that people think that self-care has to be like this prescriptive thing that uhhuh, oh, it's going to the spa. It's a spa day. It's not, it's different for everybody. Mm-hmm. And it has to fit into your life in order to like really work. You have to make it work for you. So I love that every episode is different and y'all keep it real. Some of the shit just don't work. It's not gonna work for you.

But look, try this. Yeah. I think that's great.

[00:33:38] Vanessa: Yeah. And it's really interesting, like some people. Do go to the spa. Like I, I have an episode coming up with Kim Ellis, the diabetes np, and she literally goes to a Korean spa like once a month. Oh. And has

[00:33:53] Naseema: like a full, like a Korean

[00:33:54] Vanessa: spa? Yeah. Like a full scrub down.

Full scrub down. Oh my God. So some people do that, like they just take a day at p t o and they do that. But other people, they're, they're. I feel like some people don't know that they are doing self-care, and so I say, what are you doing? And they're like I guess maybe I do this. Like some people, they're doing something in their life, they just haven't identified it as self-care.

So maybe some self-reflection on It like, it sounds like you're busy, like you're like a busy mom, but didn't you just take a vacation in Vegas and have some fun?

[00:34:32] Naseema: You know what? I keep on saying that. Yeah, but you know what, you're right too because like when you talked about the morning routine, I definitely have a morning routine.

I definitely have a gratitude practice, oh, so is you're making, you're making it work. Yeah. I mean, I do those things, but it's just like still, still, you're just like, go, go, go, go, go. And even in that, I'm just like, oh yeah, I do. Do I do take a little bit of time, but it's hard.

[00:34:55] Vanessa: I know, but a lot of people, like when they listen, they're like, I didn't even think about how I am taking that time.

Or how, oh, that can be considered self-care. Like I, I had a, people love when I have a dietician on and I recently had a dietician on. That clusters her work. And I do this too, where I work a couple really, really long, hard days. And then I have a short day where I know that there's a break coming.

But she does that where she, she knows when her next break is and she works really, really, really hard. And then exercises on certain days. And like she knows when the self-care is coming and she can just look forward to it. And it's not every day. But she, and that's what works for her. And being busy makes her feel like when she's productive, when she cleans her house, she feels better.

And so, sometimes it's not like what you would think is self-care, but getting shit done feels like self-care. Yes, when you have a clean house, when you've paid your bills, when like whatever, whatever it is, if it makes you feel good. That's self-care too. And so like you and I like full circle, like I was saying that I am finally under six figures in debt for my student loans.

And that day that I, that, that happened, I was like, this is a good, I feel good. And so being financially on top of your game, even if you have a lot of debt like I do, like sometimes financial care is self-care. And making little accomplishments or feeling like you got something done can be self-care too.

So if you don't have time, but you're getting other things done, acknowledging, acknowledging your success, acknowledging like the, the strides you've made forward for yourself, for your family. Sometimes just reflecting on that can bring you some fulfillment. And that is enough for some people.

[00:36:57] Naseema: Yes. I love it.

Yeah. Just incorporating, I mean, all the things, but the, the financial aspect definitely is key. It's, why I have the podcast talking about finances, because I mean, I feel like if you have your finances in order, you have so much more control over your life. So if you need. Do need to take that time.

There was a period of time I needed to not work so much. I went from having two jobs and working, six days a week to working six days a month. Wow. Six days a month, so like I needed that time, but I couldn't have done that if I didn't have my finances together. Yeah. So what I love that your show just covers like such and, and, and it is still pretty.

Early, like 40 episodes in. It's substantial, but you still have a long way to go. But it sounds like you've covered so many topics in so many ways to take care of yourself. And I think that's the whole thing. Like most people do not understand that they kind of are doing the things. To take care of themselves, but being able to recognize that is what it is, and to acknowledge that goal is just as important as doing the work.

Mm-hmm. So I, I'm glad that you brought that up, but I just wanna want you to share where people can listen to the podcast, be a part of the community, because I know that they could benefit from everything that you're sharing.

[00:38:17] Vanessa: Yeah, thank you. So anyone can find us at dose of support on Instagram in our group, facebook.com/groups/dose of support.

Answer the questions there. I have a website. You can see a list of all the episodes and ways to connect there. You can email me at hello dose of support.com and the podcast is available wherever you listen. We're even on YouTube, so YouTube. Apple, Google Play, Stitcher, cast Box. Wherever you listen to a podcast, we're there.

And if you have 30 minutes in the car or when you're cooking dinner, throw it on and enjoy my sassy ass and maybe learn about a new self-care thing that you hadn't thought of.

[00:39:03] Naseema: Yes, I love it in the bite size, like just. During your commute anytime, most people have 30 minutes, they can just sit down and listen.

So there's really no excuse. You can listen to it anywhere. You can be a part of the community, but I think it's super important that as part of understanding how to embrace or how to implement self-care in your life. You have some resources and I'm glad that you have this resource. I'm super happy that you are able to join us to share your story because you have an incredible story and you've been on a journey and I know that it doesn't stop and Right.

I'm just sending you so much love and support as you're planning your grandmother's funeral, which to me, girl, I don't even know how you're talking right now because I

[00:39:49] Vanessa: would be No seriously I was just thinking I don't want your listeners to think that I am the self-care guru. Like I'm on the journey too.

I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. So I'm learning too. Every time I have a guest on, I'm like, oh, that's interesting. I should try that because I am right there with y'all. I'm trying to figure out what works for me. And it's a journey and it has to be fluid. Self-care has to change with your life.

So I, I don't want anyone out there to think like that. I've got it all together. I am learning it with you.

[00:40:20] Naseema: But no, I appreciate that and I'd rather walk side by side with someone than to be talked down to by someone. Yeah. And so, I love that you're on the journey and that we're learning together.

And like you said, it is fluid, so that fluidity is something that. I mean, like it does not stop. It does not stop. So, yeah, I appreciate what you're doing and your honesty and sharing, like you don't have it all figured out. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's it. Yeah. You don't have to have it all figured out though to be able to make an impact.

And so you are making an impact, and I know people are feeling it, and I just want more people out there to feel it. So. Make sure you guys check out the Dose of Support podcast. Vanessa is an incredible person and I have, I love what you have done for the whole healthcare community, so I appreciate you.

Oh,

[00:41:13] Vanessa: thank you, Naima, for having me today. I really, I love being a part of other shows and connecting with listeners.

[00:41:21] Naseema: We are blessed to have you here, so thank you again.

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